Upland Bird Dog Power
Upland Bird Dog Discussion Not Debate
This upland bird dog power article is not offered as an "upland bird dog expert" advice or as training information. It is merely and only observations passed onto us over the years from many hunters. It is offered here in recognition of the many plains and wood grouse hunters that come our way to hunt.
This article does not disparage between pheasant and quail hunters. The author, MAHA partner John Wenzel, hunts almost equally between pheasant and multiple quail species. Occasional trips for plains and woods grouse have taken him to several states.
Upland bird dog power amongst hunters is a topic of much discussion. Personal preferences weigh heavy. We will not enter into a debate with this segment. We will rather offer as observations those topics that Association hunters over the years and coming from a wide variety of home background have told us to be their opinion.
The common upland bird dog power topics covers the spectrum of: Range, Point Standoff, Pattern, Check Back, Steadiness, Breed.
Working Range
Topics of range are split between pheasant and quail hunters. And, more so amongst pointing than flushing breed hunters.
General agreement exist that fewer upland bird dogs can make the transition from quail to pheasant vice pheasant to quail. Much for that differential is due to range. That is for pointing breeds. Flushing breed hunters typically avoid quail hunts. This is due to faster quail flight time than shooting speed. Flushing/retrieving breed hunters are largely unanimous that their four legged partners must work the vast majority of time within gun range.
The discriminator appears that for the better pheasant point defined success requires a slower and closer working range. The common belief is that quail will take more on-point pressure than pheasants. This pressure is two fold, First length of time the quail or pheasant will freeze in place. Second, the distance between the canine on point and the quail that holds is shorter than with pheasnts.This allows for longer working range on a quail hunt. That along with the more open terrain of quail country allows for sight check back rather than physical check back Yet another cause for longer working range. The central difference in range is the pheasant and quail and their evolutionary enhanced escape behavior. Not so much the upland bird dog in question.
The pheasant evolved to being on its own or in variable number and duration groups. They occupy more closed in cover habitat than do quail. This loose social connection enhanced its primary escape behavior of running. Running is also less energy consumptive than flying. Many hunters of good pheasant canines will talk of point, track, relocate, point, track again for as many as 6 points and covering over a 1/4 mile before the pheasant either holds up for point or flushes long.
Quail on the other hand evolved into a covey fowl where a single quail is very much a rarity. Quail's survival or escape primary measure is to attempt to remain motionless and unseen. Their quick to execute secondary survival means is escape. That is to multiple quail or covey flush. That covey flush confuses predators with an overabundance of targets resulting is hesitation enough to allow the quail to escape.
No other topic is more emotional and lacks objectivity than that of upland bird dogs.
That emotion is greater the fewer number of upland bird dogs owned and trained. It is less intense for those with more favored hunting partners in their background.
The contrast seen in the field is many times stark. A good pheasant pointing canine will transition to quail points due to its habitual longer point stand off range and closer working range. The efficient quail canine works longer range with typically shorter point standoff. That combination makes for many a proficient quail runner once let lose in a tall grass pheasant field to give rise of roosters flushing wild like popcorn popping.
The difference between these two characterizations of good pheasant and quail canines has separate dimensions. The better pheasant canines works slower, have longer standoff on point. The better quail ones run faster typical of edge habitat and once having found quail will remain on closer stand off points.
Long Time Upland Bird Dog Hunter
John,
Now that I'm in my forty seventh year, limits are not as important as they once were. Give me a full day afield, with a brace of half decent partners, and I'm good. Nevertheless, its a fine day when the walk back to the truck is accompanied by a hefty game bag.
Didn't move a quail or pheasant out of first farm I hunted Saturday morning, just as well as my buddies thought they were in an all age stake. Second farm they settled down some, Ginger nailed a covey in a brushy draw in middle of bean field, Chaps backed from about 40 yds, picture perfect, took two out of covey, didn't hunt the singles. Worked hedge row back to truck, lost Chaps and found him pointing down into ditch, thought it might be one of the singles, no a big rooster actually held, on a 50 degree day, until I flushed it.
By then it was noon, almost 60 degrees and I had a 2 1/2 hour drive home. I was thinking of calling it a day, but decided to hunt one more farm in this unit that I'd never hunted. Cover was awesome, bean/corn fields intersected by grassy draws and hedge rows, feed was everywhere. Two roosters pushed out ahead on the initial hedge row, we marked their destination for later consideration, Ginger pointed another covey in the middle of a bean field, harvested two, made mental note not to miss church the next day. Turned back towards the truck and worked some thick cover bordering a bean field, Chaps wouldn't come out of it, a hen flushed, we were coming to the end of the cover, I knew what was imminent, put my track shoes on and double timed to the end of the hedge row, just in time to have that little piece of cover erupt in ringnecks. Walked back to the truck still pointing, me flushing them, and they not understanding why I just laughed, watched the roosters fly, and told them, good boy, good girl!
Thank you, and Jon, and Shawn, for all the hard work you do for all of us.
Best regards, Pedro
Point Standoff
Amongst pheasant hunters there are always some that have experienced superior point ability than others that have come before. The common thread to these superior animals is they are not better, faster or have a more efficient range to find pheasants or quail. It is that they point earlier in the scent cone. Contrasted with what many do is not pointing first scent, but creep to point preferred scent quality. These longer point stand off ranges are typically a minimum of 4 feet from a single pheasant in thick cover with under a 10 mph wind, preferable 6+ feet. Under ideal conditions may extend that point to 12 feet.
Quail points on the other hand have a tendency to have a standoff on average less than that of the better pheasant canines.
Hunt Pattern
Upland bird dog hunting patterns affect success at quail and pheasant hunts more so than any other behavior.
The best quail finding canines in the central mid-west run hard the long linear edge habitat that goes for miles upon miles. Check back for these speedsters is typically visible from ridge line to ridge line or across lightly brushed/wooded creek bottom. This quail habitat encourages running due to the open nature of the crop fields allowing 1/4+ mile direct line of uninterrupted sight.
This long running linear quail finding pattern is poorly suited for the thick, tall grass where the highest pheasant densities are to be found. It is also less effective in the long running thick and wider draws of Kansas where pheasants frequently take cover. This thick cover will quickly consume a 22 inch at the shoulder hunt buddy. A further complication is one that has been conditioned to visible check back will be hard pressed to locate his master when that capability is lost.
A pheasant hunter with a more circular pattern will more effectively cover the more uniform and block like characteristic of the better pheasant cover. Check back is not so much by sight. It is more frequently by hearing/scent until near physical contact is made such as demanded by the thick cover.
About the grouse hunter.
Between these two point finding illustrations the grouse hunter will do well in the pheasant cover. He will do acceptably well in the quail habitat.
The difference is largely the better mid-west linear edge running quail canine will find more coveys, find them faster and cover fields in less time. This difference is that a good quail hunter will cover 4 quarters in a day. A good pheasant finding canine typically three quarters in a day. This last quantitative measure is supplied for those that find a need to put nature into a box of absolutes. It is not true for all. It is an illustration that more run equals more points if all else is equal. But, that run is relative to quail or pheasant and the habitat they occupy. Neither is hunted equally.
For the grouse hunter their hunt buddies do better on pheasant. This is due to the more circular pattern of grouse hunts being good for pheasant as well. Put that good grouse canine on quail habitat and that canine will run too deep into the field and too deep into the edge. This costs time. That "deep" is crossing through the finite edge lime equal occupy into less likely cover. Compared to a good quail hunter that runs edge alone.
Upland Bird Dog Pointing Quail
Upland bird dogs and habitat vary much from locality to locality.
Out our way with a large traveling hunter membership from maine to Florida to the east slope of the Rocky Mountain Range we see a wide variety of pointing and flushing breeds. No one breed rising to predominance in terms of upland bird dog hunting power. Popularity of any one breed is another matter.
In the case of the picture above it is a Brittany pointing a single Bobwhite Quail. One of several singles points, long after the initial covey flush. The cover is milo stubble. The date is January 29 or the last week of the season. The weather was warm well into the 40's proved by the light dress of the hunter. The winds light.
The stubble cover good, that is for quail. Less than optimum for pheasant.
While to point is well within the crop field the hunt started with the covey point on the fence line more than 300 yards now distant.
Point Steadiness
Working through this upland bird dog issue came these two observations.
In terms of bells and beepers. The opinion is that bells are acceptable for quail and not for pheasant. It is the belief that pheasants are far more sensitive to noise pressure than quail. When beeper collars alone are discussed it is those set with the longer lag time from the initial stopping to point and the beeper sounding. Again, the discussion is not to immediately follow the sound of running pheasant eating devils by a beeper that in close sequence applies more pressure to the pheasant than a beeper with a longer lag time to sound.
A second discussion topic was those that hunt with others find they can walk and talk with unloaded guns enjoying a more social hunt on quail than on pheasants.
The difference this point steadiness topic brings us is that the quail will withstand more pressure of all types and remain motionless. Contrast with pheasant that is more sensitive to all forms of pressure. When it comes to point steadiness it remains in both conditions of quail and pheasant the absolutely motionless effect until flush as a minimum. Creeping is as creeping is more pressure in terms of physical proximity and noise. This assumes a stationary pheasant or quail. It does not include the relocate required of tracking.
Upland Bird Dog Breeds
Breed evaluation is a topic no reasonable hunter will enter into. It is highly personality dependent. The discussion on this page is oriented to the pointing breeds as quail are included. Overwhelmingly the most prolific quail hunters are of pointing breed hunters. Have a look at pointing Lab quail and pheasant hunters.
Upland Bird Dog & Habitat
Seeing multiple upland bird dogs in various habitats gives idea that power may be specialized to pheasant or quail and to one type of habitat. In this case a very good tall grass pheasant field.
